The right moment for a message

The feeling that this book had to exist grew from two things: Els's own desire to share her message about a subject surrounded by so much unawareness, and the many people — company directors, HR, training officers — who, after hearing her story, said: "we never thought about that, you should write a book about it." It started with a free white paper, and one thing led to another. Ten years earlier, she says, no one would have looked at the book; talking about money was far less discussable then. And even now, it's still not an easy topic of conversation.

Our strange relationship with money

Why do people feel so much shame around money? Because we have a double relationship with it, Els says. Money gives freedom, independence and possibilities, but also carries a heavy charge — a judgement attaches itself instantly, as if you've done something wrong when your affairs aren't in order. We don't talk about it with those who have less (for fear of envy), and with those who have a lot, the world quickly starts speculating about where that money came from. That double bind means we don't quite know how to deal with it.

The myth of automatic literacy

A myth Els punctures: that whoever is wealthy is automatically financially literate. Literacy — knowledge, behaviour and attitude — is one thing, but it guarantees no absence of financial stress. More important still is the distinction with financial well-being: not just being able to absorb a shock like an energy crisis or COVID, but having a plan for the future. Not a plan to become a multimillionaire, but a plan around what makes you happy and what you need for it — because money is also time. Financial well-being is about feeling comfortable, without that nagging stress about what's to come.

Ownership and daring to ask the right questions

Els connects financial well-being with ownership over your life: once you know where you want to go, you can take action. And you don't need to know everything down to the last detail — Els herself, with an entire career in the financial sector, doesn't know it all either. What counts is daring to ask the right questions, and testing the answer with someone else you trust. Especially in times of disinformation: check, check, check. The conversation touches on a relatable example — Artemis, who discovered via her accountant that a single unticked box had cost her thousands of euros in tax refunds over the years — and on the bankers' oath, in place since 2025, which Els says helps both the banker and the consumer.

"Hand to mouth" and lifestyle creep

Els explains the term "hand-to-mouth households": everything that comes in is immediately consumed. Research (including by Belgian professors) shows that this isn't only poor people who barely get by, but equally wealthy people who live so far above their means that they, too, quickly run into trouble when a bigger bill arrives or income stalls. Living above your means is also called lifestyle creep: when more comes in, you lift your lifestyle along with it — while leaving untapped the very potential to build a buffer. And the biggest myth we urgently need to puncture: thinking it can't happen to you. One in two couples splits up, anyone can fall ill — everyone needs financial resilience.

The workplace as a lever

Why the workplace, specifically, as a place to learn about financial well-being? Because it's so inclusive, Els says. Not everyone picks it up at school (although Flanders is taking fine steps in secondary education), and once you've graduated you learn all sorts of things at work — languages, personal development — but for money matters there was little. At work you reach people who would otherwise never get the chance to learn about money in a good, guided, non-commercial way. Els recently worked intensively with people from the care sector, who were enormously grateful — also toward their employer. And the workplace also offers the practical infrastructure: rooms, webinars, digital systems.

Money stress is also a business cost

For the employer there's profit too — a word Els doesn't want to shy away from, because a company only survives if there's profit, and that profit can be invested in people. Financial stress has physical consequences (headaches, poor sleep) and indirect effects: less attentiveness, more workplace accidents. Calculate those costs, and neglecting financial well-being has a negative impact on profit. Moreover, the diversity of the workplace offers precisely the chance to make it relevant and tailored — think of colleagues who send part of their wage to family in their country of origin. With cases and personas it becomes concrete instead of abstract.

Financial responsibility isn't purely individual

That way of working also punctures the assumption that financial responsibility is something purely individual. As long as we keep thinking that way, there will be too little help, Els says. It's a tangle of involved parties — government, companies, the financial sector, organisations — each carrying a piece of the responsibility. Of course your own responsibility plays a part (you do have to want to learn something), but the burden doesn't rest on the individual alone.

Does digitalisation make us financially stronger?

A difficult question, Els finds. Partly yes, but there are many risks in it. Surprisingly, it's precisely young people, who grew up with the digital, who are often vulnerable: they're so at ease with working digitally that they're no longer critical, think "I can do this" after two clicks, and so more often fall victim to fraud and impulsive buying. Alongside them is a large group — including digitally schooled people, and certainly older people — who can no longer keep up with the breakneck evolution of complex financial products, while the bank around the corner has disappeared. Digitalisation does help (online courses, practice, lots of information), but the lesson for the future is to stay vigilant and check your sources. Data can also help proactively — a reminder like "don't forget your travel insurance" — but can equally be abused; on that, Els hasn't made up her own mind yet.

The gender aspect

Is there a gender aspect to financial literacy? Absolutely — a subject that deserves a book of its own. It's less than a century since women in our culture were allowed their own account, and whoever has no access to money matters can't pass it on in their parenting either — something that echoes through generations. Els still often hears women say "my husband always did it, I know nothing about it" — and that's precisely what we must move away from, because you never know what life brings (a divorce, a death, a caregiving role). She also sees big behavioural differences: in stock-market games (which she researched with KU Leuven), boys take far more risk and often "win," while girls are more cautious. Ideally, referring to neuroscientist Eveline Crone, you'd give boys and girls almost opposite education: temper the boys, and encourage the girls precisely to dare to take risk. The same pattern shows up in gambling games, which mainly attract boys.

Dagelijks Geld

With Dagelijks Geld, Els wants to give as many people as possible access to financial education — and above all to ensure that financial well-being rises as high on the corporate agenda as learning languages, exercising or eating healthily in the canteen, so that all employees can benefit, not just the happy few. The idea starts via employers, but with rising needs (crises, wars, growing financial stress) and the sometimes slow decision-making in companies, she also meets the demand with individual guidance and webinars in small groups.

The last word

Asked for one insight she'd like to leave behind, Els simply points to her title: talk about money. Do that, and you can help people regardless — yourself, your family, your parents who may no longer be up to speed, colleagues, friends. She gives a relatable example: talk with your friends about the cost of a bachelor weekend before you set such a thing in motion, because before you know it you've collectively spent thousands of euros. Talking is the first step — and because we, certainly as Flemings, don't talk about money, that remains the step she has to keep pushing.

Waarom we meer over geld moeten praten by Els Lagrou was the starting point for this conversation. Don't want to miss an episode? Subscribe to Kom Maar Dichter on your favourite podcast platform, and join The Conversation Layer — and each conversation, transcript and extra reflection will land straight in your inbox.